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View Full Version : Hordebreaker pvp video (Gladiator Arena)



Qalamity
09-24-2014, 08:56 AM
Hey guys, this is my first pvp video, so let me know what you guys think :)

Enjoy:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Haw9PCazojg

Tomerant
09-24-2014, 09:55 AM
I'd say you are good pvper with bad music taste...

Zargash
09-24-2014, 10:13 AM
Hey guys, this is my first pvp video, so let me know what you guys think :)

Enjoy:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Haw9PCazojg

Great to see someone breaking the meta as well. I made an almost identical build (after running Harbinger, just sorcery instead of occultim which was real good as well and strong in different ways). Hordebreaker in my opinion is a very strong class a lot of people dismiss.

My suggestions and thoughs are use your Mana stars more in between down times/gap closing, use your silence more, easier wins, and think about getting lasso for the pull towards you since archery can be a pain to catch sometimes. Also think about roar in battlerage for the added slow/cc increase/cc reduction for you and reduced damage (I find its very good against your strongest fight archer since if you slow them they generally can't remove it after their escape, so its easier to catch them especially if you have lasso and you take less damage in the process). Also what is dark cloud that you cast, I don't see that ability anywhere.

Another thing, I dont see you using focal concussion? Is there a reason? Its good damage a stun and removes all enemies buffs, its one of the strongest spells you got in witchcraft for this build. Also think about using a different rotation sometimes in regards to starting with enervate/mud hand. Sometimes its good to wait until youve taken 2-3k damage, then utilize its heal.

I hadn't thought about urgency since a lot of fights end before its helpful, but I can see if the battle is extended, it could be useful.

Qalamity
09-24-2014, 11:11 AM
From my experience with this class, the 9 point passive in witchcraft(required) and occultism synergize really well with this build, so I have 0 wriggle room when it comes to cross-skill tree point distribution. This leaves me with 3 points in battlerage, and frenzy is the bread and butter of this class so two left. Next priority would be a gap closer: Tigers vs charge vs lasso. Well Charge is 12m so thats out. Tiger's does a good bit of damage(especially at 10 frenzy stacks) and aoe gap close capability, whereas lasso has a cast and no damage. This class's straight up counter is going to be archers, even if i added lasso any "half decent" primeval will still kite this to class to death(back drop, teleport, shrug it off, 28m range, my 0%pdef, overwhelm trip is all too much for lasso to counteract) and its just a tradeoff of balance. I get wrecked by primevals and other good archers(can deal with archers that don't have auramancy better but still not consistently) but wreck daggerspells and other popular assassin mages and can hold my own against melee classes depending on how the fight goes. You'll have to make a similar balance tradeoff regardless of class choice.

I'm not sure what you mean, but I use focal concussion pretty often, give it another look- focal is on my second bar, f2 key. Maybe you didn't notice because the animation is barely noticeable. I love focal concussion <3. Urgency is kind of just a gladiator skill because the fight is structured and you have time to self buff and go straight into a fight so not to waste the urgency(plus so many people purge this instead of courageous action lol). In open world, i would switch out urgency for mana force (about half the time not all the time). Also dark cloud is the active ability on the honor staff that I'm using.

Thanks for the feedback though, I do appreciate it :)

@Tomerant- I assumed most people would be adverse to the anime music lol but its what I listen to to get pumped lol. Just mute it and play your own music :)

Zargash
09-24-2014, 03:58 PM
From my experience with this class, the 9 point passive in witchcraft(required) and occultism synergize really well with this build, so I have 0 wriggle room when it comes to cross-skill tree point distribution. This leaves me with 3 points in battlerage, and frenzy is the bread and butter of this class so two left. Next priority would be a gap closer: Tigers vs charge vs lasso. Well Charge is 12m so thats out. Tiger's does a good bit of damage(especially at 10 frenzy stacks) and aoe gap close capability, whereas lasso has a cast and no damage. This class's straight up counter is going to be archers, even if i added lasso any "half decent" primeval will still kite this to class to death(back drop, teleport, shrug it off, 28m range, my 0%pdef, overwhelm trip is all too much for lasso to counteract) and its just a tradeoff of balance. I get wrecked by primevals and other good archers(can deal with archers that don't have auramancy better but still not consistently) but wreck daggerspells and other popular assassin mages and can hold my own against melee classes depending on how the fight goes. You'll have to make a similar balance tradeoff regardless of class choice.

I'm not sure what you mean, but I use focal concussion pretty often, give it another look- focal is on my second bar, f2 key. Maybe you didn't notice because the animation is barely noticeable. I love focal concussion <3. Urgency is kind of just a gladiator skill because the fight is structured and you have time to self buff and go straight into a fight so not to waste the urgency(plus so many people purge this instead of courageous action lol). In open world, i would switch out urgency for mana force (about half the time not all the time). Also dark cloud is the active ability on the honor staff that I'm using.

Thanks for the feedback though, I do appreciate it :)

@Tomerant- I assumed most people would be adverse to the anime music lol but its what I listen to to get pumped lol. Just mute it and play your own music :)

I watched again that you did have it and you were using mana stars more than it looked before ( i was watching poor quality). Your right though your biggest fight is the archer primevals and its the reason why I would encourage you to rethink your setup, since it doesn't "seem" to fill out your weaknesses. The class from my experience can just wreck melee and mages so you can shave a little off those area's. What I've come up with that makes archers "much" easier but by no means a win is this. Let me know what you think

http://archeagedatabase.net/us/calc/152624

You got 2 gap closers and a lasso, one of the gap closers when the bug is fixed will synergize with mudhand since charge snares them, when this is fixed it will considerably raise the damage of the spell and heal if you do charge+mudhand. Also with banshee's wail + mana force you will double the damage of the spell. I find the above build to be a all around build period (for me atleast), since I can use it in group play as a peeler/healer protector or a charge/tiger aoe nuker. Purge, sleep removal you name it, this build has a answer for your group vs groups. Also the roar is clutch in archer matchups since its a long hard slow and damage negator while you reclose or lasso. You also are cc'd a lot less with it up and your cc is a little stronger, win win really. You do give up the wraith but thats kinda meh in my opinion vrs anyone who has stuns or knows what they are doing. And you give up urgency, but you win a lot of your fights without utilizing it all the time (long fights it helps, but not as important vrs the archer).

Give it a look+go and let me know what you think.

Qalamity
09-25-2014, 01:29 AM
I think I may try a variation of this build for those pesky primevals, Zargash - thank you :)

Zargash
09-25-2014, 05:53 AM
I think I may try a variation of this build for those pesky primevals, Zargash - thank you :)

Your welcome, although it looks like roar is not applying proper weaken, its just cc decrease and increase now, not sure if bugged. I'd go with Crippling Mire, since its decent damage while giving a good slow, and I think sticks on them if they tele away, or more control with tripple slash with trip (fyi its a long animation, but you can move while its up and you can move way out and still hit them).

Qalamity
09-25-2014, 12:46 PM
Yeaaaah... I'm not catching primevals lol- roar/charge are too short ranged and i cant lock them down because of shrug it off. I'm not a fan of putting that many points in battlerage for a mage so I think I'm going to stick with what I have lol

Zargash
09-25-2014, 01:02 PM
Yeaaaah... I'm not catching primevals lol- roar/charge are too short ranged and i cant lock them down because of shrug it off. I'm not a fan of putting that many points in battlerage for a mage so I think I'm going to stick with what I have lol

Lol you gotta give it more of a shot then 1 hr lol, things won't click. Watch this video of a defiler, it has similar skills although major differences, but how he faces archers is how you should be looking at it. You have enough tools to do fine with that build. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TB_9CHyTUtM

First you want to start off running towards your target. Eat some damage, perhaps use your shrug it off to absorb 50% of his burst (although its a gamble cause his pindown may cause you trouble later, but sometimes it pays off). Next you should make it to 20 meters. Tiger strike and stun, if he dodges away, immediately cast lasso, if he uses shrug it off, move up doing mana stars and then charge again and then stun him and remove his buffs. Then go through your spell rotation and you should nuke him by this point. "IF" he manages to wiggle away again perhaps use you the bubble (use that instead of roar since its not doing a slow anymore and is garbage since a patch or so)(shrug it off will have expired). Then move under him and AOE/DD, hes all out of outs, and dead.

Edit: Shrug it off does not remove snare, lasso, or bubble, nor fear. Your probably not changing up your combo rotation for the primeval. Get him to burn his conversion shield real fast by stunning him, he will pop shrug it off, then bubble him or snare him (preferably bubble since you can just wait it out and the conversion shield will expire). If you catch him using his running buff as you approach him, kiit him for 30 seconds, he wont be able to cast for another 60 seconds. Theres a ton you can do, just read his skills and figure it out, that video will give you some idea's as well. I'll make a video soon as well.

Qalamity
09-25-2014, 01:47 PM
primeval uses auramancy, meaning it has access to shrug it off. I don't have shrug it off, I have bondbreaker(which is my only chance for them <3). the difference between me and a defiler is that he goes deep into defense with only a couple points in occultism meaning he can take a lot more hits and block a lot of shots from primevals, it's built to be durable and defense is a counter skillset to archery. I've made it to 20 meters and I can get my tigers strike off sometimes, this is met with an instant teleport and I usually get bursted before I can finish an enerv-eg combo even with my bondbreaker dmg reduction. Don't get me wrong, I've beaten primevals(even have a match in the above video) but they misplay or they don't know their class/other classes abilities(some try to be fancy with a shadowplay combo and will obviously die if they get that close) as well as some veterans would-those are the ones I have trouble with lol(no surprise but I've been playing for about 3 months so they are who I'd like to compete with). A good primeval is not going to be touched by me between freerunner/teleport/backdrop/shrugitoff/charged bolt because I don't have the durability to bait out his escapes and still have enough to fight back with.

Notice in the video you linked, the primeval fight starts at 8minutes. The defiler has 16k hp+is more geared than me whereas the archer seems to be running average gear(around my level of gear equivalent) The first fight defiler wins with 49 hp, second fight he wins with around 6k hp (I only have 10khp). Keep in mind this is with his defensive abilites mitigating A LOT. Also the archer is arc kiting under 20m distance which is really bad play on his part but even so the damage output was enough to almost beat the defiler (and definitely shred me with 6k less hp, and no shield/block rate buffs). I can *sometimes* beat the primevals that have around my gear(as shown in my video) but they definitely have the advantage, but on tahyangs, I've seen more primevals with 13k+health than those with under 12k. Trying to adapt my build to fight my weakness is just going to spread my focuses too thin and make me even more vulnerable to the classes I should have the edge against (mages) and make me weaker against those that are skillbased matchups(darkrunners/blighters/other melee/mage classes for lack of time). Because skills like charge or triple slash have 0 practical gain(when compared to alternatives) against anything that's not an archer. A misplayed primeval is a dead primevals vs a lot of classes (including hordebreaker) which is how I'd win even with the battlerage adaptations. The primevals I constantly lose to will not let me get in 22 m of them even if means them droppingback+stealth to just wait out burst cooldowns. Also around 19.7-20m my tiger's strike doesn't proc because of their freerunning backstep kiting that keeps em out of range before my animation gets started/my computer might just blow XD but yeah.

In your analysis of how the fight would go, he would save shrug it off for an enerv-eg combo mitigation/hellspear if he gets caught. Also I don't have the money to constantly respec every arena match(with how much I play em XD) depending on the class I'm facing.

I admire the enthusiasm but I urge you to test some of this stuff yourself.

Zargash
09-25-2014, 04:04 PM
primeval uses auramancy, meaning it has access to shrug it off. I don't have shrug it off, I have bondbreaker(which is my only chance for them <3). the difference between me and a defiler is that he goes deep into defense with only a couple points in occultism meaning he can take a lot more hits and block a lot of shots from primevals, it's built to be durable and defense is a counter skillset to archery. I've made it to 20 meters and I can get my tigers strike off sometimes, this is met with an instant teleport and I usually get bursted before I can finish an enerv-eg combo even with my bondbreaker dmg reduction. Don't get me wrong, I've beaten primevals(even have a match in the above video) but they misplay or they don't know their class/other classes abilities(some try to be fancy with a shadowplay combo and will obviously die if they get that close) as well as some veterans would-those are the ones I have trouble with lol(no surprise but I've been playing for about 3 months so they are who I'd like to compete with). A good primeval is not going to be touched by me between freerunner/teleport/backdrop/shrugitoff/charged bolt because I don't have the durability to bait out his escapes and still have enough to fight back with.

Notice in the video you linked, the primeval fight starts at 8minutes. The defiler has 16k hp+is more geared than me whereas the archer seems to be running average gear(around my level of gear equivalent) The first fight defiler wins with 49 hp, second fight he wins with around 6k hp (I only have 10khp). Keep in mind this is with his defensive abilites mitigating A LOT. Also the archer is arc kiting under 20m distance which is really bad play on his part but even so the damage output was enough to almost beat the defiler (and definitely shred me with 6k less hp, and no shield/block rate buffs). I can *sometimes* beat the primevals that have around my gear(as shown in my video) but they definitely have the advantage, but on tahyangs, I've seen more primevals with 13k+health than those with under 12k. Trying to adapt my build to fight my weakness is just going to spread my focuses too thin and make me even more vulnerable to the classes I should have the edge against (mages) and make me weaker against those that are skillbased matchups(darkrunners/blighters/other melee/mage classes for lack of time). Because skills like charge or triple slash have 0 practical gain(when compared to alternatives) against anything that's not an archer. A misplayed primeval is a dead primevals vs a lot of classes (including hordebreaker) which is how I'd win even with the battlerage adaptations. The primevals I constantly lose to will not let me get in 22 m of them even if means them droppingback+stealth to just wait out burst cooldowns. Also around 19.7-20m my tiger's strike doesn't proc because of their freerunning backstep kiting that keeps em out of range before my animation gets started/my computer might just blow XD but yeah.

In your analysis of how the fight would go, he would save shrug it off for an enerv-eg combo mitigation/hellspear if he gets caught. Also I don't have the money to constantly respec every arena match(with how much I play em XD) depending on the class I'm facing.

I admire the enthusiasm but I urge you to test some of this stuff yourself.

Ya I do a lot more group pvp than 1v1 and the guys on my server are new (I'm new as well, but a natural pvper). So the ones I've faced seemed very beatable, but you seem to know what your talking about rather in depthly so I imagine the class can be played a lot better than I've faced. Still I'm up for the challenge and think if you can keep snares up, bait out a shrug it off, and bubble them or trip during it, you can perhaps manage, but thats for both of us to find out I guess ;) Cheers, good talking/theorizing.

Qalamity
09-26-2014, 02:25 PM
good luck to you dude!

Qalamity
09-30-2014, 02:19 PM
Shameless bump

viperroos
09-30-2014, 11:16 PM
That moment when you realise... You have lots to learn xD

Asset
10-01-2014, 02:15 PM
Nice conversation going on here... Good Job Qalamity and I agree with you the good primevils are extremely hard to beat. Thankfully there arent too many good ones just FoTM per say ones.

How do you do against Stone Arrows?

Qalamity
10-01-2014, 04:11 PM
Nice conversation going on here... Good Job Qalamity and I agree with you the good primevils are extremely hard to beat. Thankfully there arent too many good ones just FoTM per say ones.

How do you do against Stone Arrows?

Bout 50/50 lol- They're much easier to keep locked down but also if you get too close, well bull rush silence lasts a long time >_>

Asset
10-01-2014, 05:24 PM
Cool.. Im leveling one up now just because there are so many primevils and they hard counter them so easy. I have yet to lose to one in WPvP... I love the ones that dont know how to kite and get in range so I can stunlock them down.... and if they do know how to kite I can easily out damage them thanks to my defense skill tree.