View Poll Results: Do you feel Player Nations need to leave the game?

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  • Heck yes!

    92 60.53%
  • Heck no!

    21 13.82%
  • Don't care

    6 3.95%
  • We should just change the system to work more fairly

    33 21.71%
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Thread: Remove Player Nations From NA Archeage

  1. #1
    Junior Member Phaeroah's Avatar
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    Remove Player Nations From NA Archeage

    So, I know what the people reading this must be thinking reading the title of this suggestion.

    Take out a whole feature of the game that changes the dynamics of every single server in current existence? That's crazy talk! However, I ask that you hear me out, and take everything I'm saying into consideration.

    This is the want and desire of a large majority of the players of the game. And I don't say this just because it supports my personal opinion on the matter. I have genuinely taken the time to go around, asking players how they feel about it, voicing my opinions in faction, and seeing how others felt. The ones who refuse to join the player nations, and even some of the people in player nations agree with this sentiment.

    The installment of player nations has not only rendered the pirate faction conceptually worthless, (since they are pirates without the disadvantages of inability to claim castles or go on mainland), it has ruined the west and east factions alike.

    Any server with a player nation worth mentioning, is content blocked from all content worth doing.
    Mistmerrow, Thunderwing titan, Leviathan, Kraken, Red Dragon, Even Halcyona and GR/CR, PN's show up to 'troll' and content block. Ect. They are not to blame. They are simply enjoying a game mechanic which is so readily available to them.

    There will be those that claim west and east are free to ally and contest, however, this will still prove to fail. Player nations tend to absorb majority (not all) of the most geared and skilled players from both factions into their ranks. Numbers are unimportant when you take into consideration that one 6.5-7k+ GS player, can wipe at LEAST 4, usually more, 5k GS and below players. When you take majority of geared players from east and west, that is all that is left. People equipped with soulforged and celestial obsidian, sometimes a few divine pieces here and there.

    Well, why don't they gear up? Some will ask that. Others know why.
    Trade packs will not catch any player below 6k GS up to those who are already above that without it being supplemented with apex>gold>gear. And most people's GS's are stagnant if they are not in a player nation.

    As larders are no longer profitable unless you are moving a massive amount of them, which most people are uncapable of, most are left to move basic packs. Basic packs which will likely never be more than same continent runs. Doomed to run Gweo to solz, ect ect. This is due to PN players camping housing zones/specific choke points in war zones picking off even raids of 10+ players trying to move packs. Even with a raid, you are almost never safe. Moving those basic packs, will only net around 15g max for ferts or any other high value packs you can for the most part, safely run. You regenerate 2500 labor every 24 hours. For anyone unable to afford patroning more than one account, this means a maximum of about 21 packs a day. Which means a maximum of 315 gold a day, assuming they are able to run the maximum value fert/basic pack, at least 21 a day.

    315 gold a day, in comparison to the hundreds of thousands of gold player nations farm off of world bosses/end content/castle peace funds every week/other week, which is distributed among them, along with any cargo packs/trade packs they steal and or make and run. The free gliders and weapons/armor given to them from end content, which is completely unavailable to east and west.

    Now sure, that 315 gold a day nets about 9,450 gold a month. 7,770 after you subtract the two apex needed to re-patron, as much of Archeage's player base, Is free to play. But that gold equates to no more than two divine pieces (if even) every month. That is assuming they run 21 highest value basic packs every day. Without fail. Which means it would take around 3 and a half months to get a full divine set, assuming each piece is around only 3.1k. This does not include the mats to tier the obsidian/ect pieces up. Then there are weapons/shields/bows/instruments/accessories/costumes/cloaks.

    And while that person waits 3 and a half months to get a full divine set, there are player nations which give divine pieces of gear to a random member every week or less at random. Or who just evenly split gold in supplement to any gold they make on their own. That could be around 1.5k+ gold a day for each player nation member, counting their own gold made. Meaning they make more than double the average player, meaning since most of them already rest at 6.5k+ average gearscore, they have more than double the amount to sit on or advance with.

    Because of this, it has made it easy for Playernations to wipe both east and west simultaneously. It allows player nations to capture and protect more than 1 castle at a time, (in my experience player nations tend to have around 3+ castles on average), even across servers. For example, KGB capturing most of Krakens castles, and having transferred off and been able to maintain those castles in their possession a few months ago.

    This would be a massive change to the game, and the dynamic of all servers, albeit, a necessary change.

    Too many new players, and old player alike, have left, or are planning on leaving archeage, due to Player Nation imbalance in comparison to east/west/pirate factions. Many more say if the game doesn't improve or implement some sort of balance, they are sure to leave. Even player nation members have gotten bored at the lack of PvP, or the imbalance of. The inability to really fight the east and or west, because they get trampled with ease under the sheer numbers (normal west/east guilds are limited to 100 people per guild, while player nations have the ability to add a large sum more than that), and gear of player nations.

    This game has become Playernation VS Playernation, unfortunately. And a lot of the time, even then, player nations avoid fighting other Player Nations, and go to servers they know they can freely farm on. This is a problem not only because it invalidates both factions of East and West, but because they are also exclusive on who they let in. You HAVE to play x amount, you HAVE to already have a GS of X or higher, The GM/members HAVE to like you. You HAVE to drop what you're doing to show up to content. You even have GL's like from disaster who screech and call his members '♥♥♥♥♥♥ed' if they make mistakes while learning in PvP. It breeds toxic behavior.

    There will be people who say I'm whining,lazy,stupid,ect. My problem with Player nations isn't that I'm not winning (I actually was in a few different Player Nations). It is that there are now two factions that will NEVER WIN against these nations. There is no server that has been able to genuinely contest any player nations who are doing content. People show up, get wiped with ease, repeat this 10x or so, and people stop showing. They don't want to give PN free honor, lose gear durability, and waste time on something that's inevitable. Losing is fine. Losing most of the time is even okay. However, losing 100% of the time isn't fun.

    I do not mind the people who won't admit the imbalance this system brings. However, for the players who are here to really make this game last, keep it alive, and be apart of it's community, I ask for your support and or honest feedback, based as objectively as possible on the information we have.

    Thank you for your time.

  2. #2
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    And leave the EU servers to get wrecked by player nations? Oh no you don't! If NA gets a server that doesn't get wrecked EU gets a server sheltered from player nation ruin.

  3. #3
    Junior Member Phaeroah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReadingIsGood View Post
    And leave the EU servers to get wrecked by player nations? Oh no you don't! If NA gets a server that doesn't get wrecked EU gets a server sheltered from player nation ruin.
    Haha, I assume by your response though, You agree with the sentiment that Player nations are unbalanced?

  4. #4
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    Well put. I agree wholeheartedly and have been saying the same thing. The one guild on Morpheus that could withstand the zerg of Disaster alts refused to siege (being payed not to). Now it appears on Thunderwing that the 3 player nations have become one. Disaster only has 4 people, They Came From the North only have 2, while Westside has all 100 positions filled, and it seems they are poised to take all the castles. All members are 6.5k GS and up, so i don't foresee many people contesting them... This, alongside the lack of land for the overpopulated west, is sure to have many more leaving in droves. I know i have felt less compelled to play since the merge.

  5. #5
    Junior Member Phaeroah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enyo View Post
    snip
    My point exactly..
    This game will not survive much longer in it's current state, when people are instantly discouraged and blocked from all content..

    And that is a shame because this game has a lot to offer. And post balance patch, more people would have returned..

  6. #6
    1. Content being taken by a PN literally changes nothing from how servers were before that feature was in place; you take away nations, people will just go pirate together and form guilds and do the exact same thing.

    2. If 10 5k gs players can't kill 1 7k gs player, they need to get better at PvP. 7k gs =/= ONESHOT INSTAKILL EVERYTHING

    3. I have made about 6k gold in 2 weeks doing just trade packs. Haven't sold apex, haven't gotten any lucky regrades. The ONLY thing I've done is run trade packs, and it's so much simpler than it was before to make money. Just takes some time to figure out the best runs for your time. (I only spend about 2 hours doing trade runs a day, with breaks in between)

    4. PN can't camp every pack run in game, and there are still plenty of safe zone runs that make plenty of money.

    5. You regenerate 2880 labor a day + 450 labor from sleep buff with pajamas + 1k from a labor stipend (which I highly recommend). And on top of that, because of how much money you can make doing trade runs, you can use some of your profits to buy labor pots which sure, will cut into your silver/labor, but increase the amount of total money you can make a day.

    6. Most of ArcheAge isn't F2P, don't make that assumption. I can tell you, plenty of people just pay a sub fee since it's only 15$ a month which means you can save an extra 1.6k (on NA) that you don't need to spend on apex.

    7. There are diminishing returns on gearscore; once you reach a certain threshold, there's only so much you can improve on without needing tens of thousands of gold per piece, which means that it's easier to reach 6k gs from 5k than it is to reach 7k from 6k.

    8. KGB doesn't have castles on Kraken...?

    9. Player nations can't have more than 200 players. East and West can have as many raids as they can possibly bring.

    Look, you're not whining, or lazy, or stupid. You just don't seem to understand that Player Nations just made the concept of teaming up to form a dream team of PvPers more convenient; removing that mechanic literally does nothing. My original server, Lucius, was dominated by a pirate guild that recruited the top players from both East and West. People simply aren't willing to put in the effort that it takes to reach the level of these guys, and fight them using actual strategy. Guilds are too busy doing their own thing so no one bothers teaming up and fighting back.

  7. #7
    Junior Member Phaeroah's Avatar
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    1. Not true. Pirates when on mainland, get sent to jail. PN only get sent to jail if they have pre existing crime point, or point from killing other PN members. Also, pirates can't capture castles. Meaning they lose out on the 300k+ most PN's farm off of multiple castles. But like I said, pirates can't content block cr/gr like PN does, because they get sent to jail. Once some of them get sent, they wipe easier. That opens up cr/gr/prevents halcy trolling or victory flipping, and opens up the possibility of red dragon for West. It gives more content at the least than what is currently available.

    2. 7k vs can most definitely one shot a 5k gs. I have a full divine set, and have an Ayanad Earth shield. Full potted with honor toughness, ward grimoire, touguess scroll, and runes+ fortune dye, even with redoubt on, a 7kDr, can kill me in under 7 seconds. Mages can ONE SHOT me at 7k vs with a single gods whip. I am not trying to be rude, but if you think 7kgs dps mage or melee can't one shot a 5k gs anything, you live in La la land. I could even link you a gif of a raid of 6.5k+ mages killing Glenn in under 30 seconds..

    3. There's no way you make that much off of 100% safe packs. And not everyone can be on every day, especially not 2 hours every day. And you say that they can't always camp every run, but you're wrong. Most have green alts they leave stationed in specific spots to call out runs to one another. And in fact, at any given time, there is about 30 PN players on at any given time in just one PN guild. Where as 15 max for most east and west guilds on my server. Those figures are not realistic. And like I said, even at 315 gold a day, you still make significantly less than a PN player who makes that just for showing up to content. And you also have to remember, even the highest value basic packs are not available for everyone. Not everyone has a fert house or haulers or cars or an active guild or free time to be on when pn is too busy doing content.

    4. Most who pay subs are the ones who swipe. Those who don't still aren't making extra money?? Free to play players aren't going to buy apers just because they save 15$ on their sub. Most people who are ftp are ftp because they lack any money to spend on the sub at all. Let alone apex.

    5. You admit there the only people who can advance past a certain gs are those with hundreds to thousands of gold to dump into it. Like said player nations farming that much every week.

    6. No KGB doesn't currently have them. But they did for an extended period of time when I was on Kraken.

    7. East and West can't coordinate together like multiple player nations can. If we fight in groups our aoes and chain attacks will kill each other. Not the case with player nations.
    And in fact, this will be made even easier for them when 4.0 drops, because of the ability to merge raids into one massive raid.

    8. If you think no one has teamed up and attempted to fight player nations, you are not playing the same game as I am. People team up, coordinate, show up, and fight. Then they are trampled. Instantly. PNS wipe massive west contests and east contests alike like they are nothing. When you lose every single time, and it is apparent you have no way to win, no matter how you strategize, you will not attempt to fight a losing battle. You give in and join those who can win. Which is why most flock to player nations.

  8. #8
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    Player Nation is a wonderful idea in a crowded server, top 100 elites fighting against 600-700 lower gear score people, clashing for contents etc.

    Right now it's like 100 elites fighting 60 noobs from west and 44 noobs from east lol

  9. #9
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    Can 1 guild conquer more castles? Yes? that is stupid as f***. Stop this madness! 1 guild = 1 castle. No alt guilds and "Friendly" scroll trade! Generate "log in barriers" in guild membership or ban guild leaders of alt-guild Systems!
    Player nation was nice idea, but developers overtrolled (overbuffed+not tedsted?) it...

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Phaeroah View Post
    1. Not true. Pirates when on mainland, get sent to jail. PN only get sent to jail if they have pre existing crime point, or point from killing other PN members. Also, pirates can't capture castles. Meaning they lose out on the 300k+ most PN's farm off of multiple castles. But like I said, pirates can't content block cr/gr like PN does, because they get sent to jail. Once some of them get sent, they wipe easier. That opens up cr/gr/prevents halcy trolling or victory flipping, and opens up the possibility of red dragon for West. It gives more content at the least than what is currently available.

    2. 7k vs can most definitely one shot a 5k gs. I have a full divine set, and have an Ayanad Earth shield. Full potted with honor toughness, ward grimoire, touguess scroll, and runes+ fortune dye, even with redoubt on, a 7kDr, can kill me in under 7 seconds. Mages can ONE SHOT me at 7k vs with a single gods whip. I am not trying to be rude, but if you think 7kgs dps mage or melee can't one shot a 5k gs anything, you live in La la land. I could even link you a gif of a raid of 6.5k+ mages killing Glenn in under 30 seconds..

    3. There's no way you make that much off of 100% safe packs. And not everyone can be on every day, especially not 2 hours every day. And you say that they can't always camp every run, but you're wrong. Most have green alts they leave stationed in specific spots to call out runs to one another. And in fact, at any given time, there is about 30 PN players on at any given time in just one PN guild. Where as 15 max for most east and west guilds on my server. Those figures are not realistic. And like I said, even at 315 gold a day, you still make significantly less than a PN player who makes that just for showing up to content. And you also have to remember, even the highest value basic packs are not available for everyone. Not everyone has a fert house or haulers or cars or an active guild or free time to be on when pn is too busy doing content.

    4. Most who pay subs are the ones who swipe. Those who don't still aren't making extra money?? Free to play players aren't going to buy apers just because they save 15$ on their sub. Most people who are ftp are ftp because they lack any money to spend on the sub at all. Let alone apex.

    5. You admit there the only people who can advance past a certain gs are those with hundreds to thousands of gold to dump into it. Like said player nations farming that much every week.

    6. No KGB doesn't currently have them. But they did for an extended period of time when I was on Kraken.

    7. East and West can't coordinate together like multiple player nations can. If we fight in groups our aoes and chain attacks will kill each other. Not the case with player nations.
    And in fact, this will be made even easier for them when 4.0 drops, because of the ability to merge raids into one massive raid.

    8. If you think no one has teamed up and attempted to fight player nations, you are not playing the same game as I am. People team up, coordinate, show up, and fight. Then they are trampled. Instantly. PNS wipe massive west contests and east contests alike like they are nothing. When you lose every single time, and it is apparent you have no way to win, no matter how you strategize, you will not attempt to fight a losing battle. You give in and join those who can win. Which is why most flock to player nations.
    1. Pirates get sent to jail on land, true. That doesn't apply anywhere other than the main continents, meaning the only thing a pirate can really do is RD. PN isn't gonna stop every CR/GR, just go to a later one if it bothers you that much.

    2. I'm at 4.7k gs, and while a 7k DR might be able to stunlock me and kill me with some lucky crits, if there's 10 people at 5k gs, and no one can CC this one person, you're all hopeless regardless.

    3. If you don't think I can make that much, then you clearly haven't looked at the trade system in depth. And you don't need to be on everyday, or spend 2 hours at a time. But I promise you, there are plenty of people that CAN do that, who spend even more time than I do, and get much less done. And if you're not using your time wisely, that's on you.

    4. I pay a sub. I don't swipe. 15$ a month isn't much for me to fork over; I've played other MMO's and didn't have a choice then, so 15$ now is not much for me to pay, and I'm certain that considering WoW still has several million players that there are plenty of people who can afford to fork over 15$ and not necessarily want to pay more than that.

    5. If you're needing to spend hundreds of thousands of gold to upgrade your gear, you already have a high gearscore. Most people are not at this level yet, so they don't need to spend as much, you completely missed that. DIMINISHING RETURNS.

    6. Is there even a nation that's currently holding castles on more than one server?

    7. I've been East and have teamed up with West to fight pirates. It takes coordination, but it's not impossible. Get on TS/Discord together and figure it out.

    8. That sounds like someone who doesn't deserve to win complaining about losing. I've literally been East on every server I've played since before the first set of merges, and on literally every server, the East has gotten its ♥♥♥♥ pushed in like nobody's business, and I never bothered trying to join the enemy. Where's the fun in that?

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