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Thread: This game doesn't need MORE servers (fresh start, prob needs merges) it needs a way for players to get COMPETITIVE PVP GEAR quickly

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by SakuraCalleil View Post
    /sigh where to start.

    Archeage is an mmorpg, as with all mmorpg grinding is a part of the 'end game' as the sense of achievement you receive working months or years towards a goal makes it very fulfilling. If you remove that, you might as well go play Ark or a Moba. The issues you are stating with archeage are common against all MMORPGs, name one game (good one..) that once you reach level cap all content is open to you? Take WOW, try getting yourself a raid team doing mythic endgame content with fresh level 110 gear, you'd likely have to spend months grinding the older content to catch up. Same with Blade and Soul (which is very much like Archeage in its pay to win aspects). Free handouts are never the answer.

    Archeages problem is its linier catchup mechanism, gear improvement comes pretty much at the cost of gold and crafting. Dungeon gear is pretty much redundant and this is the (imo) place they should focus change and improvement.
    Uhhh, this is false. WoW progression is not slow in the slightest. The only thing slow in WoW are the arena rewards, which obviously take quite a bit of time effort and wins to rank up.

    I could get you up to the level cap and have you doing experienced battlegrounds without a huge imbalance in 2-4 months. <----With casual playtime not even playing 3 hours a day.

    There is no GRIND in WoW. If you wanna progress you do it. None of this korean style rng chance to progress. Unless you wanna count competing with pugs in dungeons for drops as "grinding" which can easily be avoided by running with a guild and having members pass loot priority. (Semantics)

    So break it down. 2 hours a day as a mega casual is about 3 months to hit the cap. (Level 110)
    Add in 2 weeks to get raid ready <-------AS A SOLO PLAYER. Without a guild that number is way lower with a guild.

    Now lets say you're not a mega casual and you play 8 hours a day.
    Thats 1 week to get to the cap.
    Plus 2 weeks to get raid ready as a solo player without a guild....

    THAT MEANS IT ONLY TAKES YOU 3 WEEKS TO START DOING COMPETITIVE END GAME CONTENT IN WOW......NOT 3 YEARS....

    Korean mmos have been pushing that propaganda of it taking you a lifetime to do anything significant in a game and its false as hell.
    Truth:


    Trion and XL games hates everything I say because its the truth and stings like fire.
    Exposing the weaknesses in your circuit would send most to react in a way to fix the chain.
    Instead we get to see an awkward teen afraid of its flaws hiding them under the rug.

  2. #32
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    But Andromeda Delux, everyone knows that WoW is such a horrible game, why would you even compare it to anything? Oh, wait.

    But this would never work in Archeage because then - oh wait, if we had players and XL spent some of that money they could develop content.


    Just thought I'd point out that after 3 years nobody here is actually capped out yet. Just saying. Maybe in a couple more years someone will reach the current cap here.

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Witchbell View Post
    Honestly I feel like gear wouldn't be important if there were objectives in the game that could be obtained or reached by any player. The problem in the game is there are only a few major objectives in the game which requires strong players to even take down and even stronger players to contest. This leaves the weaker players with nothing to do other than farm for their gear and avoid combat all together unless its in balanced arenas. Instead of focusing everything on single targets they should introduce elements that are ongoing and rewarding. Capture points are a great way of doing so. For example lets say each of the islands in the Halcyona gulf contains a special resource which can only be gathered by the faction who controls it. Get your factions members on the island to slowly work your way to controlling it, the more members you have, the faster you can claim it. If anyone contests, you can choose to fight them or flank around the gather materials while the others hold them off. Players too strong to fight against? No problem, there are other islands and other materials to gather. One faction is zerging every island? No problem, they can't be on during every hour of the day, so you simply organize a time to take the objectives during a slow time. Everyone can't be everywhere at once or on 24/7 and if you give multiple points for people to focus on, players will work together to strategize and obtain what they need.

    Right now the game is based around world bosses and events which are only active during specific times of the day and usually only 1 is active at a given time. It's structured to be monopolized. That is what really needs to change. The game is too focused on death matches and resource monopolization when it should focus on coordination and teamwork. If such a change would be made, it wouldn't matter what your gearscore you have because there would be options for you to make a difference and help yourself progress. We should have multiple areas within the game which has ongoing events that could be triggered by player interactions, so more people would feel the need to travel to otherwise boring parts of the world. We should have battlegrounds alongside the arenas to encourage teamplay rather than focus on kills. If cross server arenas are possible then cross server dungeons que should also be possible. In the end players just want to have fun and the best way to do so is to encourage everyone to participate and reward them for doing so.
    Theres too many alts in this game for them to add in the equivalent of another abyssal point capture system but "safe". And the nation system breaks any actual competitive pvp by merging all the competitors into 1 guild. Extra systems like this would just make it worse.

    I do like the original posters ideas of putting more focused progression in dungeons. I mean, dungeons can't be stopped.

    I dunno, knowing XL and how slow they operate and how they never put in a system to balance the game without breaking several others IE, Makes getting X material easier, but now you require double to triple the material to do anything significant with it <----Thus negating the change in the first place....

    So my theory is, even if they did make sweeping changes to the gear curve, their going to add some gold fee or labor fee or make you renew your gear every 30 days for 5000 gold per piece or something stupid. YNK games doesn't even have this level of bad technical systems in their games and YNK is known for being terrible!
    Truth:


    Trion and XL games hates everything I say because its the truth and stings like fire.
    Exposing the weaknesses in your circuit would send most to react in a way to fix the chain.
    Instead we get to see an awkward teen afraid of its flaws hiding them under the rug.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Andromeda Delux View Post
    Theres too many alts in this game for them to add in the equivalent of another abyssal point capture system but "safe". And the nation system breaks any actual competitive pvp by merging all the competitors into 1 guild. Extra systems like this would just make it worse.

    I do like the original posters ideas of putting more focused progression in dungeons. I mean, dungeons can't be stopped.

    I dunno, knowing XL and how slow they operate and how they never put in a system to balance the game without breaking several others IE, Makes getting X material easier, but now you require double to triple the material to do anything significant with it <----Thus negating the change in the first place....

    So my theory is, even if they did make sweeping changes to the gear curve, their going to add some gold fee or labor fee or make you renew your gear every 30 days for 5000 gold per piece or something stupid. YNK games doesn't even have this level of bad technical systems in their games and YNK is known for being terrible!
    I don't want people to live in dungeons, though. ArcheAge works best as an open world MMO. But Dungeons can be a good springboard to somehow get them some useful gear, learn game mechanics, etc then venture out in to the actual game.

    When everyone was doing Serpentis back in the day either for gear and then dream ring, I think it hurt the game. Not only was it unfun to run it 100 times but you don't want the entire playerbase in dungeons. Leave that for WoW.

    So, a little bit of dungeons is good especially for newer players, but eventually focus on them entering the real world.

    Also, this game desperately needs a reason to leave town. Once you are geared up running around town waiting for the next event is basically end-game content. So a 24/7 objective that everyone is rewarded from, but still contains PvP would be a great idea to get people out of town with something ALWAYS to do. Maybe you could have objectives on top that's more "pvp focused" but also in the depths of the waters surrounding this pvp objective are objectives or rewards for people trying to avoid that aspect. Still the biggest problem with this idea leads back to the same core issue, newer players are going to get slaughtered and probably won't find it fun.


    And you can upgrade much quicker in other games. This is the most P2W game I have ever played. Why? Because you can spend easily over $100,000 and STILL not be fully capped on gear. It's insane! BDO has TONS of catch up mechanics for newer players and AA would be smart to copy some of it over. And that's a "KR grind MMO" just like this one. Each game has their separate set of issues but AA desperately needs a way for newer players to get in to the game.

    And everybody being outraged about "free handouts" .. 8k gearscore isn't anything lol. It's literally a starter package to let new players to actually enter a PvP zone and have fun without quitting the game. And you are still going to have easily a years+ of grinding ahead of you to get real gear. God forbid they actually have FUN while grinding for a year to catch up. As a 10k+ GS player I want more people. More people everywhere. People in the seas, people in PvP zones. More guilds fighting for content. A massive influx of people is what this game needs (and honestly, less servers.. and more restrictions on transferring). I wouldn't be upset at all as a 10k+ GS player to have everyone in the game have a free 8k gs set to compete with me. They have a gift set that isn't tradeable or upgradeable in any way. Nothing was taken away from me. On the other hand, if you either lower legendary+ damage or raise divine-epic damage a lot, I feel like this is a big slap in the face to me.

  5. #35
    Senior Member Noxm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richinja View Post

    And you can upgrade much quicker in other games. This is the most P2W game I have ever played. Why? Because you can spend easily over $100,000 and STILL not be fully capped on gear. It's insane! BDO has TONS of catch up mechanics for newer players and AA would be smart to copy some of it over. And that's a "KR grind MMO" just like this one. Each game has their separate set of issues but AA desperately needs a way for newer players to get in to the game.
    Sadly you cant do what BDO do, cause obv here you have a lot of player multiboxing me include. When you give some incentive to new player, you give this bonus 5-10 times to actuals players.

    Trion/Xl games fault, they allowed us to multibox when it's forbidden on archeage KR/JPN/RU, that an other things make archeage loose a lot of players on our region.

    ex: on Archeage Ru we found out they did a T6 Celestial Marathon gear yo help to catch up in 3.0. you gain token for this gear by doing event like MM, rift, craft ect ect.. if you allow that in EU/US we will ruins the economy with our 5-10 multiboxing account players.

    Also now i start to understand why RU/JPN/KR got one free legendary dungeon weapon and not our region.

    Quote Originally Posted by Richinja View Post
    And that's a "KR grind MMO" just like this one.
    It's "EU/US multiboxing MMO or p2wmmo or slowprogressmmo" your choice.

    ?

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Richinja View Post
    snippet
    You're probably one of the few within that gearscore range that actually do want more people and exciting fights etc. Cause every other person I've seen in that gear range just ends up joining up with their competition instead of fighting and playing against them >_>. Archeage is like league of legends, if your mid hit level 6 and as soon as they did they joined the enemy team...then the people left that didn't join the red team disconnect from the game (which is completely logical btw) while the red team players go "Man I really wish there was some competition" <---Literal Memory loss or something I have no idea how to explain this logic.

    This game needs jesus. And even though you want people, if the mechanics of the game continue as they are "people" are just gonna keep dropping off left and right till theres only 1 server left, and then shut down....Been playing this game since beta under different leadership roles and I watch for things like population shifts, player activity, guild dynamics etc... and theres a pattern to it.

    Game starts>TONS OF PEOPLE>Server statistics stay pretty evenly distributed between east, west, pirate>People stay regularly active>Land locks up>First wave of people either quit or don't play at all due to land reliance and land being full or locked up>Regrading starts playing a factor in pvp and general fights and content AKA rng based progression starts this includes costumes etc>Second wave of people quit due to being locked out by RNG mechanics>Player population shifts heavily due to people quitting>Guild populations shift heavily due to people quitting>People make up the deficit in players by trying to group more people into a handful of guilds(without realizing 1+0 is still just 1>Guilds continue competing and...oh wait Nation system? > Nation system devours players that would have been separated by guilds>The barrier of entry for pvp keeps growing > Since all the other systems that make people quit are in continuation more population is lost due to a combination of all of the above ^ Server Dies > Server merge happens > The entire process repeats itself.
    Truth:


    Trion and XL games hates everything I say because its the truth and stings like fire.
    Exposing the weaknesses in your circuit would send most to react in a way to fix the chain.
    Instead we get to see an awkward teen afraid of its flaws hiding them under the rug.

  7. #37
    Senior Member SakuraCalleil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andromeda Delux View Post
    Snip
    So, did you agree with my post in general but not like the example and felt you had to write a wall of text about why wow is easy?

    I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this. As a former member of a mythic raid team, we would only invite exception people who had gear and experience on par with our own. Unlike Archeage, wow progress is gated with time lockouts instead of pure grind.

    If you have friends who boost you (who will drag you through instances and give you the drops), you can progress a lot quicker but the same goes for Archeage and other mmos (hey, which is why we join guilds? to exploit others ? ). This factor should be ignored (just like ignoring Pay to Win).
    Sakuracalli (West)

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by SakuraCalleil View Post
    So, did you agree with my post in general but not like the example and felt you had to write a wall of text about why wow is easy?

    I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this. As a former member of a mythic raid team, we would only invite exception people who had gear and experience on par with our own. Unlike Archeage, wow progress is gated with time lockouts instead of pure grind.

    If you have friends who boost you (who will drag you through instances and give you the drops), you can progress a lot quicker but the same goes for Archeage and other mmos (hey, which is why we join guilds? to exploit others ? ). This factor should be ignored (just like ignoring Pay to Win).
    Doesn't matter nothing in WoW takes you 3 years to do.... WoW has its systems in play so you can do the content without spending 3 years first to lead up to it. And it isn't about the game being easy, its been that way since at least burning crusade. I just get miffed when people use time and grinding for excuses in an mmo to cover up shoddy design choices. WoW was created for an American audience and a lot of those developers know how to improve upon a game and make content for it and keep people active within it without having to resort to "A grind" to do it. There's so many quests and alternate paths for dungeon gear and pvp gear they don't need to resort to that. (Especially with the current dungeon queues) Tac on the fact that all of the instances in WoW are intuitive and constantly in balance along with the pvp and you have what MOBA's are based on.... <---yes, mobas are based on WoW/Warcraft systems just expedited from a month or so and condensed into 30 minutes.

    Archeage comes from a different lineage completely. Its largely based on quickly made eastern mmo's whos systems (thank god) have never made it into mobas. Instead they utilize gacha systems and gambling whos market shifted toward mobile mmorpgs where everything you unlock is hidden behind a gacha or your main method of progression is completely random. Such a fitting name in english btw.

    You don't join a guild to exploit others, you join a guild to get with like minded individuals to move toward a goal. You call it boosting, who's to say they aren't training up a new potential healer for a raid they've had issues with? <----So who's exploiting who? Its not even on the same level as pay to win. Aside from that I do like the approach of the OP in regards to this game because quite simply, XL isn't gonna ever reach the level of Blizzard or even Trion about creating content for this game. So you may well see them have to push out free gibs on gear or ideas similar to the OP's because they can't overhaul any systems.
    Truth:


    Trion and XL games hates everything I say because its the truth and stings like fire.
    Exposing the weaknesses in your circuit would send most to react in a way to fix the chain.
    Instead we get to see an awkward teen afraid of its flaws hiding them under the rug.

  9. #39
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    This game has to allow new players to be competitive on legacy servers and reduce gear gap somehow.
    New servers kill the game further by dividing existing players. After such division, server merges become a necessity after some point. People lose their land with every merge, half of them can't find new land and quit. This is a sandbox game with a virtual world, land and active population matters.

    We just need a regular "new player" inflow to legacy servers in order to balance quitting players. If they get one shotted like current situation (gear gap), they won't stay for long and quit. Just give new players some opportunity to fight against people on legacy servers, reduce gear gap, limit maximum damage to prevent one shots etc. PvP success shouldn't be exclusive to top 100 GS elites.

  10. #40
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    Wow looks terrible visually, I wouldn't spend 5 years playing a game that looks like it comes from a cartridge.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tr34 View Post
    If they get one shotted like current situation (gear gap), they won't stay for long and quit. Just give new players some opportunity to fight against people on legacy servers, reduce gear gap, limit maximum damage to prevent one shots etc. PvP success shouldn't be exclusive to top 100 GS elites.
    Well the important part that op is missing, armor doesn't scale as much as weapons, especially with the erenor stuff, You will still get nuked by players with huge weapons, even with the free 8K stuff (lol)

    Here was Gamepro's graph, this is an awesome solution. Handing out gear is a temp solution and doesn't solve the issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamepro03 View Post
    I'll just post these here again...

    Item Quality versus Stat charts - Near Current (missing 3.5 info) and the proposed solution to help gear gap while actually buffing everyone who currently has Epic+ Gear (making everyone feel good, hopefully, but yes still closing the gear gap). Essentially all that I've done is flipped the chart, where upgrading quality early gives more of a boost than upgrading quality in the higher tiers.



    This last chart looks at each tier and named tiers. Named tiers are Illustrious, Magnificent, Epherium, etc. The chart may be a bit hard to understand, but it makes clear that between each named tier lies a 20-25% stat gap. This isn't necessary the worst thing since progressing through this gear is linear, however the gap between each gear is rather large currently, and if you stack that ontop of the quality issues that I've listed above, the gap becomes enormous between many common items. A solution here would be to possibly reduce the difference between each named tier, however I feel that the grade differences listed above are much more pressing.

    This is a universal change and everyone gets something out of it

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