View Poll Results: How you like a trade pack change ?

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  • No, i like spending my day doing trade runs, i have no life anyway

    4 33.33%
  • It is ok the way it is , i have my alt farm anyway

    2 16.67%
  • Yes , i want to have fun and not spend all day doing trade runs

    6 50.00%
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Thread: Trade run change, to maximise fun time

  1. #1
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    Post Trade run change, to maximise fun time

    i would like to submit an idea
    implement in game for trade runs ,

    concentrate trade pack

    it would require 5 to 10 time the mats needed for 1 pack
    with also lp cost increased
    and of course gold at trade point equal to the trade in value for a 5 or 10 times bigger pack

    why do i propose that ?
    simply because it does become a really big pain to do any event having people so much focused into making gold
    this is really time consuming and after that people don't have much time left for anything else
    so mainly it is slavery for gold time wasted and not FUN

    People want to have fun this is the main reason people come in a game
    people are grinding daily and so much bored of the endless amount of time grinding
    that people end up quiting

    so please transmit that idea to the devs team
    so much nothing to say .... xD

  2. #2
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    Biased poll is biased.

    This is the point of cargo, auroran packs, and vehicles that carry more packs.

  3. #3
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    Seems to me that before something like this is added, the pack values should be changed first.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Rinalee's Avatar
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    i don't even see the point of this poll + the answers are kinda... ridiculous?

  5. #5
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    Imagine they do this. Next I, a competent no-lifer, will spend even more time on trade runs because much profits. So your idea does not fix the described problem.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Termocaos's Avatar
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    Even if changes like these are implemented, and here i come being realistic, where more gold is generated, more gold sinks are introduced, that's how XL rolls, by adding more "fun" we'll see the change reverted into a new or increased gold sink somewhere else.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redge View Post
    i would like to submit an idea
    implement in game for trade runs ,

    concentrate trade pack

    it would require 5 to 10 time the mats needed for 1 pack
    with also lp cost increased
    and of course gold at trade point equal to the trade in value for a 5 or 10 times bigger pack

    why do i propose that ?
    simply because it does become a really big pain to do any event having people so much focused into making gold
    this is really time consuming and after that people don't have much time left for anything else
    so mainly it is slavery for gold time wasted and not FUN

    People want to have fun this is the main reason people come in a game
    people are grinding daily and so much bored of the endless amount of time grinding
    that people end up quiting

    so please transmit that idea to the devs team

    So my hauler carries 8 packs + 1 I carry. Oxiom apple tarts are what, 100 ground grain and 20 apples? So I would need x5 - 500 ground grain and 100 apples to make One single pack? x10 would be 1000 ground grain and 200 apples for one single pack.

    In all, to make a single traderun with a full load thats (x10) 9000 ground grain and 1800 apples.

    Doesn't seem like a good idea to me.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Aired's Avatar
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    XL has a delicate system. They don't make things easier on purpose. The point of any game is of course fun, but they purposely make things take time, labor and resources for various specific reasons. Why packs take so much time to make any amount of good gold is so you spend time playing the game. In the cases of more rewarding packs, it is only because it is riskier. That risk can involve multiple people's time. So if you get ganked that same pack which if ran in safe methods would only pay less, but because the risk of getting ganked which uses up your time and at least one other person's time, can pay more because of its providing content to more than just yourself.

    If you haven't already noticed it, anytime XL changes anything, they really don't change it. Crafting got changed a fair bit, but the net result was stuff costing basically the same amount at the higher tiers. Regrade rates were made better but it was offset by reducing the great success chance and what I'm starting to believe a severe reduction in the number of superior charms available, with additional labor and resources mixed in via the transmutters.

    Some of this stuff really upset me, the list is long and somewhat subjective to my personal point of view but I often call XL changes, “XL Change, Not Change” as they tend not to really change anything. I suppose the reason why this originally bothered me is that I couldn't understand what the heck they were trying to accomplish. This really lies in with the communication and honestly a lot of stuff I still have no idea what they are thinking, but in this particular case, I can somewhat understand they are trying to do. This is to keep the continuity of the game for those that have been playing a long time vs those who are just starting. They can't outright give everybody erenor items because those who spent a ton of real-life cash would be upset, but also the game would become boring quickly. I also realize you're not talking about erenor items in your post, rather trying to create a dynamic which allows you to do a trade run that is more profitable in less time, which you're equating to fun. That said, the ultimate goal of earning more gold is to have better things, so I used erenor as an example but you could apply the same logic to building an Enoan, or mansion or whatever your goal is.

    That said understand that when we ask for anything, better drop rates, more of this or that, XL may provide that, but “most” of the time at some cost. Lately, the trend has been to eject more labor cost into everything, which is pretty sneaky thing as it is an inadvertent way to increase their cash flow. Most of this region doesn’t think much about labor due to alt accounts, but anyway you slice it more labor to the same thing does mean more money for them. Another very important fact is a super trade pack which I believe is what you’re advocating for, would have to balance with the same considerations. Given the current dynamic and what I believe I know how XL does things if they were to do it, they would do it in a way that doesn’t really change anything.

    On top of that XL creates very little new content anyway, and what they do create on a continual basis is more times than not to monetize it. New costumes, mounts, gliders, vehicles, housing items etc. all are continually pumped out, but only because that means more money. The balance they strike with many systems is skewed towards pushing people to the cash shop in one form or another. I could list just about every system in this game and show how this relates to the cash shop. But, that effort would be fraught with discontent and really has no bearing on how much fun I or you have in the game. I have long ago accepted this game for what it is. I also realize that while I am doing a fair bit of XL blaming here, they aren’t alone in this venture. In fact, the whole gaming industry at large is swimming in a cesspool of greed. What we are ultimately left with is finding our own fun, realize the game for what it is, accept it or don’t, and make friends and have fun.

    TLDR: Be careful what you ask for you may just get some version of it.

  9. #9
    Junior Member Omanko's Avatar
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    XL has a delicate system. They don't make things easier on purpose. The point of any game is of course fun, but they purposely make things take time, labor and resources for various specific reasons. Why packs take so much time to make any amount of good gold is so you spend time playing the game. In the cases of more rewarding packs, it is only because it is riskier. That risk can involve multiple people's time. So if you get ganked that same pack which if ran in safe methods would only pay less, but because the risk of getting ganked which uses up your time and at least one other persons time, can pay more because its providing content to more than just yourself.

    If you haven't already noticed it, anytime XL changes anything, they really don't change it. Crafting got changed a fair bit, but the net result was stuff costing basically the same amount at the higher tiers. Regrade rates were made better but it was offset by reducing the great success chance and what I'm starting to believe a severe reduction in the amount of superior charms available, with additional labor and resources mixed in via the transmutters.

    Some of this stuff really upset me, the list is long and somewhat subjective to my personal point of view but I often call XL changes, “XL Change, Not Change” as they tend not to really change anything. I suppose the reason why this originally bothered me is because I couldn't understand what the heck they were trying to accomplish. This really lies in with the communication and honestly a lot of stuff I still have no idea what they are thinking, but in this particular case, I can somewhat understand they are trying to do. This is to keep the continuity of the game for those that have been playing a long time vs those who are just starting. They can't outright give everybody erenor items because those who spent a ton of real life cash would be upset, but also the game would become boring quickly. I also realize you not talking about erenor items in your post, rather trying to create a dynamic which allows you to do a trade run that is more profitable in less time, which you're equating to fun. That said, the ultimate goal of earning more gold is to have better things, so I used erenor as an example but you could apply the same logic to building an Enoan, or mansion or whatever your goal is.

    That said understand that when we ask for anything, better drop rates, more of this or that, XL may provide that, but “most” of the time at some cost. Lately the trend has been to eject more labor cost into everything, which is pretty sneaky thing as it is an inadvertent way to increase their cash flow. Most of this region doesn’t think much about labor due to alt accounts, but any way you slice it more labor to the same thing does mean more money for them. Another very important fact is a super trade pack which I believe is what you’re advocating for, would have to balanced with the same considerations. Given the current dynamic and what I believe I know about how XL does things if they were to do it, they would do it in a way that doesn’t really change anything.

    On top of that XL creates very little new content anyway, and what they do create on a continual basis is more times than not to monetize it. New costumes, mounts, gliders, vehicles, housing items etc. all are continually pumped out, but only because that means more money. The balance they strike with many systems is skewed towards pushing people to the cash shop in one form or another. I could list just about every system in this game and show how this relates to the cash shop. But, that effort would be fraught with discontent and really has no bearing on how much fun I or you have in the game. I have long ago accepted this game for what it is. I also realize that while I am doing a fair bit of XL blaming here, they aren’t alone in this venture. In fact the whole gaming industry at large is swimming in a cesspool of greed. What we are ultimately left with is finding our own fun, realize the game for what it is, accept it or don’t, and make friends and have fun.

    TLDR: Be careful what you ask for you may just get some version of it.
    One of the more insightful posts that I have read. It encapsulates the state of affairs from a macro level and sums everything up beautifully. Thank you.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aired View Post
    snip
    I agree with Aired, and think his observations are spot on. I do have a slightly different take on the OP, and on a couple of Aired's points though.

    Re lack of charms, I'm honestly not sure. I've noticed it too, but my first thoughts are that either less RNG crates are being purchased = less supply, or maybe people just aren't going with Erenor, they're sticking with high grade Ayanad or whatever instead - or everyone's getting their Erenor to the point where their fodder needs charms.
    I agree that crafting in general works out to a change that equaled the same cost for the crafter - buyers I think are in a much better position now though, so...I'm not really sure. I think they're good changes in that prices for high tier gear have gone down, but I certainly agree that it's pretty upsetting from a crafter's perspective.

    Re progression speed, I think it might still need to be increased. At the least, we don't need more new sinks. I haven't been here since launch, but I feel like if you've been with a game since launch or you're the biggest cash spender in the game you should be able to be in full BiS max gear after a couple of years. That certainly isn't the case...other regions have a bunch of players running around in full Erenor, most of which is pretty high grade if not max grade - I think XL/Trion should at least keep that in mind when making changes for NA/EU, if not try to identify and fix that. I think I've made my point already, but it IS pretty hard to catch up to someone who's still progressing themselves....

    Re the OP, I can't agree with that. Archeage has a very delicate economy balance, and I think reducing the time cost of trade runs that much and increasing the cost of materials would not be healthy for the game. It would likely completely ruin the viability of all other professions in comparison.

    All base mats would be bought up by traders, crafting and prices would just be rough. Legacy might finally have a decent amount of charcoal though...just nothing to use the charcoal on if all the mats that go into oils and such are being made into trade packs.

    HOWEVER...it's fairly obvious that things as they are aren't very healthy regarding trade and charcoal. All you have to do is look at the various threads almost every patch since 2.9 on how things seem to be spiraling downhill with changes that miss the mark effectively or just plain end up feeding charcoal to the freefarm zerg and making them the new major source of charcoal...because??? (Oh, while simultaneously increasing the number of packs needed to be turned in to generate charcoal through actual trading.)

    TLDR: I don't think this change would be good for the game economy. I do agree that things aren't perfect, not is trading perfect. I just think changes other than this specific one would be better.

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