Gold making... what IS worth it?

[Enyo]

lol. But still 31% doesn't make up for the inflation of everything else (or to mention the 12g profit for taking it through 'danger' zones), the most important and trend setting of which has gone up ~300%. A 7g profit pack on both where many players goal is to buy 2 items that used to cost ~550g each and now costs ~1750g each. That's still 3 times the work (and time) for the same result.

Add to it the increased costs of regrading, crafting, charcoal, and pretty much everything else, and those old profits start to sound pretty good. I know it's easy to get your head stuck in them pretty new higher payouts, but in the end you make far less than in the new systems when you begin to adjust for inflation.


I'm sorry Snerdles, for hijacking this thread on a trade tangent. Hopefully someone can actually come up with a constructive response on a system that has increased reward 300% over the last 2+ years.

[Mangogogo]

My definition is casual play being able to afford patron and a path to gearing up/building adding potato stuff on activities on one character from new to veteran players. Right now, new players are finding it harder to progress by just playing the game. I am doing fine since I've built everything I needed and making gold is actually even easier since alts supply processed mats to AH for me. The new changes basically added 2g penalties to every non-fertilizer packs for new players without cars doing their runs on wagons/haulers and removed jesters crate farming from easier mobs for them too. Can't say much about fishing since I've never tried it.

Existing players that have multiple patroned alts complaining about their 'system being bad' now, that's just whining to me. The concern for me is for players that dislike alts who are starting out and don't mind not contesting are being forced to altage or noage at all while I could play until now without a 2nd account and doing just fine.

You guys are making comparison about profit from alts that didn't mind spamming trade packs into 107% by himself/herself in the past. They didn't care about efficiency before and wouldn't now.

Also miss the time when one can stop during a trade run for irl stuff without losing value.

[Bobitoz]

Making 1 trade route viable per nation and keeping the mechanic that lowers the % dependent on how many people are turning in that type of pack is just a dick move.

"You get 30% increase if you do it in 15min."
"Oh, but it's always going to be at %100 turn in now."
"Oh, when you started it was at 120%, well too bad, better turn that pack in, it only has 3 min. left on it"

Why do you think staging was even a thing? It wasn't because people liked to hoard packs for fun.

[FTRek]

to average/ new players , anything above 600gold/hour is reasnoable
if you can maintain 1200g/day
you keep your gold and spend it wisely, after 1 year it would be 400k+
which is enough to gear up into top 100 on most servers, especialy if you mix hiram pieces in

yes, it takes 1 year to gear up now, or 6month of hardcore grind with multiply accounts.

alot of items were added into the game like costumes/ T3 gems , charcoal prices increased alot, same with APEX prices
new player needs to grind way more stuff than lets say 2 years ago.

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Now if you are making bellow 600g/hour you got no chance to compete
transfering to "cash" with Trion prices of 10euro per APEX, 600g are 1/3rd of an APEX which would be 3euro.
so if you are unable to generate atleast 3euro /hour, its better for you to simply find a job and p2w

Now most P2W whales are buying gold from botters/sellers which sell at 2.5euro per 1k
which isn't allowed by trion policy, but as an example.
someone can work 1 hour for 25 euro and come back home and buy quick 10k

in the meanwhile casual players grind their life, 20hours of traderuns to come to 10k gold

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Anyway, up to you how seriously you treat the game
or whats your goal in the game
to compete with others or just hang around and role play

And how exactly do you make 600g/h?.. Even some of the best profs do not give more than 100g~ hour and it's still very limited by daily labor you gain.

[Snerdles]

lol. But still 31% doesn't make up for the inflation of everything else (or to mention the 12g profit for taking it through 'danger' zones), the most important and trend setting of which has gone up ~300%. A 7g profit pack on both where many players goal is to buy 2 items that used to cost ~550g each and now costs ~1750g each. That's still 3 times the work (and time) for the same result.

Add to it the increased costs of regrading, crafting, charcoal, and pretty much everything else, and those old profits start to sound pretty good. I know it's easy to get your head stuck in them pretty new higher payouts, but in the end you make far less than in the new systems when you begin to adjust for inflation.


I'm sorry Snerdles, for hijacking this thread on a trade tangent. Hopefully someone can actually come up with a constructive response on a system that has increased reward 300% over the last 2+ years.

But this is exactly what I'm talking about. Trade system profits are up pretty much across the board. Yet people still maintain that it's terrible. So what else are people doing that is safe that is pulling in mad gold. If everything is nerfed then nothing is nerfed.

Making 1 trade route viable per nation and keeping the mechanic that lowers the % dependent on how many people are turning in that type of pack is just a dick move.

"You get 30% increase if you do it in 15min."
"Oh, but it's always going to be at %100 turn in now."
"Oh, when you started it was at 120%, well too bad, better turn that pack in, it only has 3 min. left on it"

Unless your destination trade post has 200 cargo already in it then one of the pack types from that area are going to have high turn in values. On the east, for instance, you can go from Villa to Solis or Solis to Villa an make 11-18 silver per labor or so. If one pack starts piling up you just run another pack.

Back in 3.0 zero of these runs made even 10 silver per labor. In fact, the highest silver per labor in either direction was about 4.5s/l. The aged packs for this run back in 3.0 quite literally lost money. Now every single one of these packs is viable.

[Mangogogo]

It's terrible relative to the cost of other stuff also increasing. Syn soap every 30 days. Patron. Hereafters. Regrading gold costs. Yeah you earn 1 silver more per labor hooray.

Also ppl were running safe packs to falcorth back in the days. Some even did solis to rook. *shrug.

Duck downs were so cheap cross region alts were making free packs in hasla for people to turn in. Aaaa those were the days.

[Snerdles]

It's terrible relative to the cost of other stuff also increasing. Syn soap every 30 days. Patron. Hereafters. Regrading gold costs. Yeah you earn 1 silver more per labor hooray.

Also ppl were running safe packs to falcorth back in the days. Some even did solis to rook. *shrug.

Duck downs were so cheap cross region alts were making free packs in hasla for people to turn in. Aaaa those were the days.

4.5 -> 12+ is not 1. You also have more labor available. The people who did Solis to Rook were on to something, it actually made decent money. Almost as good as Solis to Villanelle today.

[Enyo]

But this is exactly what I'm talking about. Trade system profits are up pretty much across the board. Yet people still maintain that it's terrible. So what else are people doing that is safe that is pulling in mad gold. If everything is nerfed then nothing is nerfed.

Take the blinders off for a second and stop looking at just the bottom line increases, and start looking at the cost increases. Yes, we may be making 31% more silver per labor, but items have not gone up 31%. On average, the items have gone up 200%. Maybe we do make more than we did, but it's not enough to make up for how much things cost when adjusting for inflation. Some of this could be negated through the use of many alts feeding one main, but that's not in the spirit of the game, nor is it a way to draw in new customers (also it requires more alts than before).

This problem gets compounded further when it comes to gearing up. It was quite the grind to try and get Ayanad at ~20k a piece, especially for a player without alts. That was the top gear for some time, and then Erenor comes in and the stats absolutely demolish Ayanad's, but at a huge price. That's even more cost, that a typical casual player will not be able to achieve in years. Hiram is more grind than someone who has a family and works and allots 2-3 hours a night to play can achieve in months (a year+ if we bring in t3). And then all of that time is put strictly into grinding the same mobs. Gearing wouldn't be nearly as hot topic of an issue if we had diminishing returns rather than the exact opposite, but that's another subject.

My definition is casual play being able to afford patron and a path to gearing up/building adding potato stuff on activities on one character from new to veteran players. Right now, new players are finding it harder to progress by just playing the game. I am doing fine since I've built everything I needed and making gold is actually even easier since alts supply processed mats to AH for me. The new changes basically added 2g penalties to every non-fertilizer packs for new players without cars doing their runs on wagons/haulers and removed jesters crate farming from easier mobs for them too. Can't say much about fishing since I've never tried it.

Existing players that have multiple patroned alts complaining about their 'system being bad' now, that's just whining to me. The concern for me is for players that dislike alts who are starting out and don't mind not contesting are being forced to altage or noage at all while I could play until now without a 2nd account and doing just fine.

You guys are making comparison about profit from alts that didn't mind spamming trade packs into 107% by himself/herself in the past. They didn't care about efficiency before and wouldn't now.

This post is in the spirit of what people are complaining about. We were doing fine without needing alts, and since we started in that time and got established, we still don't need them. But our progress has severely slowed due to rising costs in everything, and it's very difficult to hook a new player in the current setting. It's similar to minimum wage not going up with the costs of living and everyone now living in debt and requiring loans whereas 60 years ago they didn't, but there are no loans in ArcheAge. Instead, we simply do without and leave.

[Snerdles]

Take the blinders off for a second and stop looking at just the bottom line increases, and start looking at the cost increases. Yes, we may be making 31% more silver per labor, but items have not gone up 31%. On average, the items have gone up 200%.

That's just because gold is so easy to get. You get an extra labor a day from sleeping now, and an extra 2400 through the month just for clicking. Instead of 86400 per account you can have up to 5580 every day just logging in and sleeping twice if you want and pay for your account. If you make 10 silver per labor you make 558g a day with that, or 16740g a month. That's just with labor alone.

Playing free isn't meant to be easy. You are literally asking someone to give you 20 bucks for playing a game. It's going to take some time or else why would they spend 20 bucks on you? They are buying your progress, if you don't think it's worth it then stop selling it.

[Mangogogo]

4.5 -> 12+ is not 1. You also have more labor available. The people who did Solis to Rook were on to something, it actually made decent money. Almost as good as Solis to Villanelle today.

You are comparing apples to oranges. Nobody did solis to villa or villa to solis. Maybe compare solis to fal or SF to Fal to solis to villa. I don't think the returns was 4.5s/l. Also one have to compared with +5% bonus instead of +30% bonus. Thanks.