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Thread: Lets discuss Crit Damage Vs. Defense Penetration post 5.1

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Nodoze View Post
    Yeah I figured Durah maybe mistyped. When I first read his post I actually read crit rate instead of crit damage and didn't catch it was incorrect until I referred someone else to the thread and re-read it. I told him the summary conclusion correctly from memory but then when we came to the thread it was backward so I posted to get it clarified/corrected.

    So to summarize the thread, "if you want be a pure DPS role, it is recommended to build one of 2 ways:

    1-Reach Critical Damage cap (300%) and then put rest into Defense Penetration;
    ... OR
    2-Reach max Defense Penetration and then put the rest into Critical Rate (not Critical Damage);

    Some general thoughts between the two choices:

    A Defense Penetration build is most effective against low defense sets (cloth and leather) while a Critical Damage build is more effective against high Defense set (plate mostly);

    A Defense Penetration build is good for a more constant high DPS while a Critical Damage build can give a higher burst damage;

    For melee Critical Rate depends on Strength levels so melee DPS builds can better pull off a Critical Damage build, while melee Tanks with high Stamina are better off choosing Defense Penetration. "
    I would say that it's a good base-line but not completly correct.


    First we need to remember that a Critical Damage Build is always a coin flip, since is based on RNG... A RNG that have multiple sources that can make it go wrong: Resilience that reduce Critical Rate (From 4% to 7% every 1000, still don't have an accurate number, give me some time to give you all a precise answer) and Parry/Block that negate the Critical Damage.

    But in any case, even without counting the Critical Rate Reduction and Block/Parry, I made all the Math about that in another Thread, and until 20k/22k P.Defence a Melee Player (Thanks to Puncture Passive) deal more overall Damage in a Full Defence Penetration Build (Obviusly against a Target with high Resilience), so Critical Damage Build SHOULD become better against a Plate+Shield Player aka 23k/24k/25k+ P.Defence (But there is a catch, since Resilience decrease Critical Rate too and Block also deny Critical Damage, that is pretty much the only source of damage of a Critical Damage Build, so that mean that even in that case, Defence Penetration could probably deal more Damage).


    So, When is Critical Damage better? (A little note, while it's true that a "Stamina Tank" should go on the Defence Penetration Route, it's not true that a "Strenght DPS" should automatically go on the Critical Damage Route, for a "Strenght DPS" is a choices based on the things mentioned and that will be mentioned)

    1) Against low Resilience Target (Not really a good thing, but not everybody have good Gear)
    2) Against Player with the same P.Def as your Defence Penetration as a Critical Damage User (So for example if a 2H User Full Critical Damage Build can reach 210% Critical Damage and 3k Defence Penetration, Critical Damage Build will be better against Players with 3k or lower P.Def (6k with Puncture Passive))
    3) Against Players with 25k-ish or more P.Defence, but it depends on how much you are able to Crit and since with 25k+ P.Def they will probably be a Tank, it will not be easy to Crit on them, so is not guaranteed to be better than a Defence Penetration Build.


    But yeah, pretty much is like that, in the end both Builds work, so is pretty much a choice on what someone want to do.

    I always advice for a Defence Penetration Build because it favors the match-up against who you should suppose to target and kill aka Cloth+Shield(Healers), Leather Players or 2H/DW Plate DPSs... Since even a Full Critical Damage Build that menage to always Crit would do ridicolous Damage against a Plate+Shield Tank... It's not really the job of a Melee killing a Plate-Tank, when a Mage can do that in few seconds.

    Against Cloth Users without Shield, both builds will end up three-shotting them, so it does not really matter how you Build.

  2. #42
    Senior Member Firenation's Avatar
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    How to reach crit damage cap(300%)? I got maximum %256 crit damage with full hiram and gems.

    I tried to do with a full crit damage, agility and crit rate with my hiram set, and as extra I used focus gems on my gloves and x2 hiram armor. However, most of my ranged attacks are evaded or blocked or parried still against geared players (leather, cloth, plate it doesn't matter; but thy hit me so easily comparing my attacks on them). How to hit without our attacks are evaded?

    Then I changed my crit damage to p.defense penetration and in pvp it started to make some difference; but not absolute. However, still my attacks are evaded. There is too much defense in the game that ranged attacks of archery is not so good in most pvp cases.
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  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Firenation View Post
    How to reach crit damage cap(300%)? I got maximum %256 crit damage with full hiram and gems.

    I tried to do with a full crit damage, agility and crit rate with my hiram set, and as extra I used focus gems on my gloves and x2 hiram armor. However, most of my ranged attacks are evaded or blocked or parried still against geared players (leather, cloth, plate it doesn't matter; but thy hit me so easily comparing my attacks on them). How to hit without our attacks are evaded?

    Then I changed my crit damage to p.defense penetration and in pvp it started to make some difference; but not absolute. However, still my attacks are evaded. There is too much defense in the game that ranged attacks of archery is not so good in most pvp cases.

    You can't reach 300% Critical Damage by Gear alone, indeed the max for "T3 Epic Hiram + T1+5 Gems" is 255% for DW and 210% for 2H.

    300% is reached with Critical Damage Bonus from Ability like Steady Shooting for Archery or Delyrium Stacks/Battle Focus for Battlerage.

    Indeed Critical Damage have a lot of counters, Resilience first followed by Block and Parry... This is why Defence Penetration is better in most cases.

    For Evade (Or Block and Parry) you can't do much, aside from having Focus Gems on Gloves and hoping for the best.

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