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  Click here to go to the first Archeage Team post in this thread.   Thread: Upcoming Changes

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by TehSaboteur View Post
    Just because you have the means to grind and grind for an item in game it doesn't justify adding a pay for convenience option to the cash shop and call it not P2W.
    thats exactly what pay to win is.. you have the ability to get it in game by putting in a few extra hours or what not, and poof it can just be baught with cash... =p2w

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Living Steel View Post
    thats exactly what pay to win is.. you have the ability to get it in game by putting in a few extra hours or what not, and poof it can just be baught with cash... =p2w
    They believe that an item has to solely be only available in the cash shop and no where else to be considered P2W, which is absurd.

  3. #13
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    Ok then if you do this, take my owl-post and give me back my 400 diligence i'll buy it for crystals

    btw it's p2w

  4. #14
    Junior Member Sprobe's Avatar
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    I'd like to give you back my warehouse, owl and saving pendants, give u credits and u reimburse my diligence ok?
    Darkrunner, Belstrom

  5. #15
    Senior Member Turambaredolas's Avatar
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    Before I start what I want to say let me give an answer to the question:
    How is p2w defined in games like Archeage?

    My definition is the one I hear most of the time from other players as well:

    Something is considered pay to win when spending money allows you to
    (1) buy endgame items (which hasn't ever been the case in AA as far as I can remember)
    (2) speed up your progress directly (e.g. infusions on legacy)
    (3) sell something to get gold and speed up your progress indirectly (e.g. APEX on legacy) or
    (4) bypass playing certain parts of the game (e.g. you don't need to grind honor, vocation, etc)

    Keeping in mind those three points there are some quite heavy p2w aspects on Unchained even though some of the may not be as obvious:
    • Gold selling and buying is more alive than ever and based on the amount of people who openly admit of having bought gold the numbers of players having bought gold at least once should be somewhere between 50%-90%. This is the main core of p2w on Unchained and the publisher does not even see anything of the money that is transfered there. It's not gamigo's fault for 'allowing p2w in their game' but it is their fault for not making sure that this form of player-driven p2w is not punished (or not enough - because in some cases it is enforced)
    • 3 account rule: You are allowed to buy additional accounts to get a theoretical increase of +200% of your daily income. This is even more important when there are people buying additional accounts directly or from other players, which again breaks other rules as well. Every single additional character is able to participate in events and dailies and is also a source of sellable honor, vocation, diligence and any other currency which can be turned into gold.
    • You can turn certain items into images and put them onto tradable items to sell them. It was obvious from the start for armor and weapon pieces because making them only "bound" can easily be bypassed. However even the huge change about making costumes untradable is nullified by being able to craft a certain tradable costume (because even if it is expensive to craft, it still allows you to bypass this anti-p2w system).
    • Having paid DLCs is fine as long as they DON'T allow the buyer to progress in any way differently from someone who does not buy it. However, the Garden DLC allows the player to have a sped-up progress on hiram T4 and access awakening scrolls for T5 which cannot be gained in any other way without buying the DLC.
    • Premium Archepass: It is ok to have access to costumes and image items (except for the points mentioned above), but having free amounts of hereafter stones and getting experience on the title level is still p2w even if it is a very low form. However there are more concerns about the usefulness of the current premium passes as pointed out by Gamepro03 (click)
    • The shop has items that fall under "(4) bypass playing certain parts of the game" and is getting more as we can see with this announcement. If I have the option to buy for example a Bound Anywhere Warehouse for 300 diligence coins and I am now given the option to buy it for money, it means that I can buy something else instead like 10 Expension Scrolls and sell them for 500g (current price of my server).
      In order to avoid this problem it should be that any item on the shop for credits or on the website for money should not be obtainable in any other way in the game.

    PS: @Diamante
    Was this thread really meant to be in the Official Discussion chat so we could actually talk about it or should it have been under News &Announcements like almost all other posts like this?
    A child of song, a child of rage
    Abandoned in another age
    Now ancient hate and rhymes that bind
    Make paradise a tomb divine
    And demons trapped in beauty’s thrall
    Hunt those who heed the bloodsong’s call.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamante View Post
    We would like to explain the term “Pay-to-Win" item because we have found out that this might lead to confusion. A “Pay-to-Win" item gives an ultimate advantage over someone who does not own this or a similar item. So long as we ensure there are other ways to get a specific item, it is not considered as “Pay-to-Win". If it saves you time, it is not considered as “Pay-to-Win" because you can compensate by playing more or having different tactics.
    So in other words, you feel it is all right to put Eternal T3 Erenor gear in the cash shop because you can get it in game. That's not "pay to win" in your eyes?

    Then tell me - what the hell did I pay $50 for? If I wanted this "not pay to win" system I'd play on legacy.

  7. #17
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    This is a horrible idea.

    The mailbox costs 400 diligence.
    That 400 diligence can be put for Srendipity stones or Decrystalization scrolls which offer a direct in-game advantage.
    Your definition of p2w seems to just be biased.

    What you're essentially saying is "It's okay to put an Erenor weapon on the cash shop because there is another way in-game to get it."

    Instead of fixing real issues like the 30k honor price on Serendipity stones you guys are thinking of more ways to make the game more miserable than what it already is.

    Get a grip.

  8. #18
    Btw, we can not craft the mailbox and sell in game on AH to make gold as merchant price is only 10 copper.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Turambaredolas's Avatar
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    Since the marketplace just went live with those changes:

    Where is the logic in having the same credit price for the warehouse and post owl, but have a different diligence price?
    A child of song, a child of rage
    Abandoned in another age
    Now ancient hate and rhymes that bind
    Make paradise a tomb divine
    And demons trapped in beauty’s thrall
    Hunt those who heed the bloodsong’s call.

  10. #20
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    Add Erenor gear & gold on credits, not p2w, you can get them ingame by crafting & farming

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