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Thread: Here's why server merges help casual players more than they think and stabilizes the economy.

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Empyreus View Post
    The biggest problem i feel with mergers, especially at this point in the games lifecycle.

    Is the amount if items even a standard character owns. Between all the bound items, this and that, another forced merger almost another year in would result in a severe reduction of resources for a LOT of long term players.
    I transferred one of my characters recently. It was a character I created just prior to Evolution. Once I sold of all the stuff I accumulated, I found I had 10,000 gold worth of crap in chests. It was during the regrade event, so that 10,000 gold came in handy. Converting extra assets to liquid funds isn't always a bad thing.

  2. #32
    Senior Member Nerrivic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PooperJackson View Post
    Go up against a guild full of red dragon gliders and get back to me. They are spawned in to the game out of nowhere and give an extreme advantage. It counts.
    It does not count. Because the gold you earn by selling whatever the dragon drops is already there. It was part of the existing gold in the system before the dragon was killed. It was produced by someone else (probably some poor fool driving their hauler all day long.)

    Quote Originally Posted by PooperJackson View Post
    The weapons go for roughly ayanad prices since they are ayanad equivalent, you are suggesting that ayanads will double in value if RD weapons will. Can't see why that would happen.
    I suggested nothing of the sort. I never mentioned crafted weapons.

    Quote Originally Posted by PooperJackson View Post
    You people have no idea what you are talking about. Red Dragon weapons are constantly priced at or around Ayanad prices. Most people consider them a cheap alternative.
    If something has the same price of something else, it can't be cheaper. However, the fewer "cheaper alternatives" are on the market, the fewer people will be able to buy them. Thus, it hurts the potential buyers, aka the "casuals" you are talking about.

    Quote Originally Posted by PooperJackson View Post
    Half the spawn rate of RD = double the value of the weapons is the most lulziest BS half thought up argument I have ever read.
    Uhhh...rarity drives prices up. That goes for pixels, as well as for resources in the real world. Rarity of Dragon weapons would most likely result in people spending their gold on other weapons instead. But since it's still the same gold, it still does not affect inflation, so it doesn't make a difference anyway. You seem to believe that if existing gold goes to crafters instead of free farmers, it will stop inflation - I'm afraid that's about as correct as your original calculation.

    But hey, you know what....I'll just leave you to your musings. Seems safer that way....
    "Always forgive your enemies - nothing annoys them so much."

    Oscar Wilde on ArcheAge

  3. #33
    Senior Member notebene's Avatar
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    Your post assumes what motivates me to play the game are the same things that motivate you, and by extension (?), motivate everyone.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerrivic View Post
    It does not count. Because the gold you earn by selling whatever the dragon drops is already there. It was part of the existing gold in the system before the dragon was killed. It was produced by someone else (probably some poor fool driving their hauler all day long.)



    I suggested nothing of the sort. I never mentioned crafted weapons.



    If something has the same price of something else, it can't be cheaper. However, the fewer "cheaper alternatives" are on the market, the fewer people will be able to buy them. Thus, it hurts the potential buyers, aka the "casuals" you are talking about.



    Uhhh...rarity drives prices up. That goes for pixels, as well as for resources in the real world. Rarity of Dragon weapons would most likely result in people spending their gold on other weapons instead. But since it's still the same gold, it still does not affect inflation, so it doesn't make a difference anyway. You seem to believe that if existing gold goes to crafters instead of free farmers, it will stop inflation - I'm afraid that's about as correct as your original calculation.

    But hey, you know what....I'll just leave you to your musings. Seems safer that way....
    You have no idea what you are talking about it's obvious you do not play this game at the higher end of the spectrum so it's not worth my time debating.

    Keep on believing that this apparent massive demand for red dragon weapons is going to force them to double in value with half the spawn.

    The entire point of this thread is guilds are able to spread out across 9 server and hold content uncontested giving them a massive advantage. Does killing red dragon multiple times a week uncontested give a guild an advantage over somebody who isn't doing it or guilds on another server who are constantly fighting for it? I'll let you figure out the answer for yourself. (It's kind of obvious).

  5. #35
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    You make one huge error in your "idea". The casual player is not the one that yearns the gold from the end game sources you list. Your solution therefore does not benefit the casual player at all really and would in fact drive them away from the game.
    I've started to support global warming in the hope that it will melt all the snowflakes...

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shantar View Post
    You make one huge error in your "idea". The casual player is not the one that yearns the gold from the end game sources you list. Your solution therefore does not benefit the casual player at all really and would in fact drive them away from the game.
    LOL okay. That's why constantly the #1 stated reason most casual players quite the game is gear gap? because they don't care or don't want to compete? Why does this gear gap between the guild that runs the server and everyone else so great I wonder.

  7. #37
    Senior Member Empyreus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Punkmaster View Post
    I transferred one of my characters recently. It was a character I created just prior to Evolution. Once I sold of all the stuff I accumulated, I found I had 10,000 gold worth of crap in chests. It was during the regrade event, so that 10,000 gold came in handy. Converting extra assets to liquid funds isn't always a bad thing.
    But what if you're a crafter and have tons of mats for crafting, not neccessarily items you'd want to liquidate for a merger, as a oft time crafter myself i have several 100 slot chests packed with mats for crafting everything from weapons/armor to trade packs, etc.

    Not exactly stuff i'd WANT to liquidate quickly at bargain bin prices prior to a merge. Not everyones chests are full of "crap"

  8. #38
    Senior Member Nerrivic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PooperJackson View Post
    You have no idea what you are talking about it's obvious you do not play this game at the higher end of the spectrum so it's not worth my time debating.

    Keep on believing that this apparent massive demand for red dragon weapons is going to force them to double in value with half the spawn.

    The entire point of this thread is guilds are able to spread out across 9 server and hold content uncontested giving them a massive advantage. Does killing red dragon multiple times a week uncontested give a guild an advantage over somebody who isn't doing it or guilds on another server who are constantly fighting for it? I'll let you figure out the answer for yourself. (It's kind of obvious).
    The simple fact that I'm able to operate a pocket calculator and apply basic logic tells you that I don't know how to play the game, or what I'm talking about? Err...ok...oh man...I think I need a hug now.

    This thread, as you made it, has two points:
    1. Uncontested free farming guilds have a massive advantage over other people. That's correct.
    2. Inflation is hurting the game. That's also correct.
    Unfortunately, these two facts have nothing to do with each other. You can't cure 2. with changing 1.

    Let's say the guild "Knuckleheads" have been free farming DGS and Abyssal for a long time. They actually produced a ton of gold. Suddenly, they get contested and defeated by the "NitWitz". Guess what. The amount of gold being produced remains the same. It just goes to a different, non-casual group. Inflation is not affected.

    On the other hand, fewer DGS spawns and Abyssal packs would actually help inflation. But wether those spawns are contested or not makes zero difference.

    For the future, before you tell people they don't know what they're talking about, make up your own mind on what you are talking about. Good night and good luck.
    "Always forgive your enemies - nothing annoys them so much."

    Oscar Wilde on ArcheAge

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerrivic View Post
    The simple fact that I'm able to operate a pocket calculator and apply basic logic tells you that I don't know how to play the game, or what I'm talking about? Err...ok...oh man...I think I need a hug now.

    This thread, as you made it, has two points:
    1. Uncontested free farming guilds have a massive advantage over other people. That's correct.
    2. Inflation is hurting the game. That's also correct.
    Unfortunately, these two facts have nothing to do with each other. You can't cure 2. with changing 1.

    Let's say the guild "Knuckleheads" have been free farming DGS and Abyssal for a long time. They actually produced a ton of gold. Suddenly, the get contested and defeated by the "NitWitz". Guess what. The amount of gold being produced remains the same. It just goes to a different, non-casual group. Inflation is not affected.

    On the other hand, fewer DGS spawns and Abyssal packs would actually help inflation. But wether those spawns are contested or not makes zero difference.

    For the future, before you tell people they don't know what they're talking about, make up your own mind on what you are talking about. Good night and good luck.
    False

    With connected auction house and server transfers what happens on another directly translates to your server. Your example would be correct if there was no auction house and server transfers did not exist. Let's just say the same 30 people do ghost ships every day, two times a day. That's 30 people times 9 servers gaining 600 gold a day. If we reduce that number to 4 that's over half the gold being magically generated in to the game disappearing. If we factor in guilds contesting over it on these 4 servers it becomes even less profitable.

    You have no idea how basic math works apparently.


    Here, basic math.
    Magical generated gold in to the game on a weekly basis
    DGS with 4 servers: 168,000
    DGS with 9 servers: 378,000
    Abyssal with 4 servers: 240,000
    Abyssal with 9 servers: 540,000

    It's almost like there will be less gold poofing in to the game out of no where!


    Edit to underlined part.. So you spend all this time debating the basis of my argument only to admit that "fewer dgs spawns and abyssal packs help inflation".. so you agree that 9 servers in to 4 = helps inflation. Glad we got that out of the way. Oh and CONTESTING these world bosses DOES impact the entire economy. At the very least it will mean more demand for consumables = more profit for farmers. It goes without saying if I do DGS with no buffs = 100g profit. If I spend 20g on buffs = 80g profit. That 20g just got spread around to the farmers who made the consumables.

  10. #40
    Senior Member ykeara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shantar View Post
    You make one huge error in your "idea". The casual player is not the one that yearns the gold from the end game sources you list. Your solution therefore does not benefit the casual player at all really and would in fact drive them away from the game.
    Okay I think some things need to be explained, basic economics really the principle of supply and demand....

    First off lets tackle inflation if gold generated =\= gold consumed, gold will lose value over time. So when referring to dgs they are a massive amount of gold generation in a given day, thus reducing the pure gold generated SHOULD increase the value of gold... i.e. divine weapon is now 4k instead of previously 5k. Now if you generate pure gold i.e. tradepacks, coin-purses (well about 1/2), or tradepacks (gold only here) you are EFFECTIVELY making more gold even if you are still making the same x gold per week, simply put the gold has a higher value.

    Now there are alot of variables and other factors to the above but It does have an effect.

    This same principle applies to land, land and land products (corn etc.) will probably get more valuable HOWEVER 1/2 land =\= 2x corn price. why? Its simple really, ON ALL SERVERS underutilized land exists, you may not have planted corn because a crop would only net you 30g BUT with less land it might net you 40g now all of the sudden you go back to the corn business... okay! but the price of corn still goes up so I make less gold per pack! no. you don't the VALUE of the gold is higher so you will likely still be making more than you did previously But the total quantity may be lower.

    Like it or not you are linked as a player in this-game economically to the top guild doing dgs on your server...

    Now lets talk about opportunity cost...

    The concept is pretty simple everything has a cost, say you regrade a divine weapon for 1k gold and you use that as your weapon. How much did it cost you? 1k? WRONG, it is still costing you ~5kg why? simple because you can sell it and make that. Now this is true for everything from untradeable things as well, but regardless of if you grow your own mats or buy them from the auction house it pretty much (ah tax and the cost of your time and labor vary) If I make marianople sweeteners and grow all my mats im still effectevly using ~3g per pack, just like the guy that bought the mats off the auction house... Now technically what is happening is the labor+time< gold for me growing my own mats while If i were to buy them from the ah it would be gold<labor+time.

    What the biggest tl;dr here is every dragon weapon that would sell for ~15k if kept in a guild still gives their gear a value of +15k i.e. whether the guild sells its drops or passes them out they are still advancing. OKAY!

    In conclusion would server mergers mean that if you are not in a top-guild on your server that your effective income increases? probably, economics is a lot of guess work, but it is a fair assumption

    Now to put it another way my guild can purchase every single epic produced on the cluster continuously, and we could lock people at divine or lower gear on the entire cluster. Is this intended? Can you make your own yes, but I'm making a point, it is hard in the current state of the game for anyone to hope to catch up to a top guild without merges, they make too much gold front world bosses and events period.

    Several solutions have been opted in, but the gear gap is not so much from p2w as controlling a server, and its getting worse in the current state... merges/evolutions are the ONE solution that I know of that Trion can do without consulting XL....and therefore feasible.
    "we advise refraining from appealing this decision further" - Trion Support

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